Quality in-Quality out

I have been specializing in the repair and restoration of vintage plumbing fixtures for nearly twenty years now. I long since came to the conclusion that being old does not make something good or worth restoring. Yes, there is a correlation, and yes, things do not seem to be manufactured today with the same high levels of care and integrity that seemed to exist long ago.

Think about this though. Of the product that has lasted and endured for the last sixty, seventy, and eighty years, how much is that longevity associated with good design? By good design I refer not only to solid enduring function, but to timeless visual appeal. Yes they last but do they last longer because we like the look of them and continue to keep them in working order? What of the product that was not attractive? What of the product that was not designed well enough to last, be appealing, or be easily serviceable? If it wasn't well designed all those decades ago how much of it do we still see today? I have to wonder how much our estimation of the value of older product is skewed by the quality of the remnant while we do not see the quality of the whole.

My point is this. When quality materials and good design come together enduring product tends to be produced. When economical materials and design by necessity come into play the resultant product will not tend to endure. I typically express this notion by simply saying, 'Quality in-Quality out.' I have not, until now, put my thoughts about it into written words. So there you have it.

Victorian Railway Car Basin.

Every now and again, in the process of keeping old fixtures serviceable, it is prudent to make their functions just a bit more modern. Case in point, look at my page...http://www.plumbing-geek.com/victoriantoilet.html
The project I want to write about today though it is a bit more extreme.

A while ago I was contacted by a local man who had purchased a very old and unusual fixture. He had acquired it at Aurora Mills, an architectural salvage house in nearby Aurora Oregon. They had referred me to answer his questions about getting it installed. He contacted me and upon my request, sent me some photos.

Open tank water source in back splash holds water at room temperature with gravity flow.

Basin has no drain fitting, just an open hole.Note the tank with affixed spigot middle left.

Pull knob at bottom right rolls wooden ball into drain hole to hold water.
When ball is rolled away, drain water drops into tin funnel and from there into a vessel that is later emptied by a porter.  

New holes in back splash to accommodate new hot and cold water taps.

 

Rear view, tin tank not in place.The photos above were sent to me. Only the basin itself was brought to my shop. It fits to the bottom of the marble countertop with wooden stays.

 I was asked to install a drain fitting into the open drain port of the basin so that it could be connected to the drainage system of the house. The only problem is that the drain opening is smaller than what a modern drain can address. I would have to make my own drain assembly.

Here is the cast brass lower portion of a regular 1-1/4" vessel drain assembly, I started with that.  I have cut a section of vintage 1" threaded tubing that had a lock nut on it and soldered the lock nut to the modern brass flange. I had to lathe cut the internal thread of the flange to allow the nut to penetrate it evenly. The threaded tubing is a close fit into the open drain hole of the basin.

Then I needed a grid strainer to joint to the 1" threaded tubing. I decided that this large brass washer would work.

Searching for a motif to follow the client and I decided that the little five petal flowers painted onto the basin would be appropriate. I knew that the result would match a common strainer pattern circa 1910. The brass washer gave me a free center hole, I would need five evenly spaced holes around it. 

Once I had the penciled on rays, evenly spaced, I added two circles. The outside circle represents the ID of my 1" tubing. The inner circle is the center of my holes and I drilled 1/8" holes where the rays and the inner circle intersected. I walked the holes to match the 5/16" size of the original center hole by degrees, using larger bits in turns. 

I then soldered the new strainer onto the 1" tubing. I had prepared the tubing for this by cleaning the edge on the lathe. Five minutes on the buffing wheel smoothed the inner edges of the drilled holes. Then it went to the plater for a coating of polished nickel. 

The new drain assembly, ready to install.

I used a closed cell foam gasket that I cut to fit. that material would seal my drain connection without adding undue force to the vintage china surface.

Another happy ending.

 Rising to the challenge of such a unique request makes the job very special.

Mid-Century Modern

Currently I, with the help of my clever and creative daughter, am preparing the graphics and text for my new advertising campaign. A local preservationist group, Restore Oregon, has offered to allow me to advertise in this year's tour guides. They will have two self guided tours this year, both are featuring homes in the Mid-Century Modern style.

I knew without hesitation that I wanted to take advantage of the opportunity be an advertising sponsor of this year's tours. For the same reasons that I love my work I am very sympathetic to Restore Oregon's drive to preserve the at risk older structures in our area. Aside from that, the timing is perfect for me because I am endeavoring at this time to forsake general plumbing repair and turn my attention exclusively toward the repair and restoration of vintage plumbing fixtures.

Collaborating on creative work requires not only the knowledge of what one desires to create but the ability to express how and why one would use the designs and language proposed. For my part, I had several ideas about what I would want to do and say. My daughter is doing a good job of keeping me grounded, helping to keep it simple, balanced, relevant, and meaningful from the layman's perspective.

The pantry faucet image is out of
my 1897 L. Wolff  Mfg. Co. catalog.

We are so pleased with the result so far that it will become the pattern for the next batch of business cards. During the first phase she and I had several preparatory talks and at last one long creative session to agree upon the main elements of the primary graphic that will go on Restore Oregon's website. She then produced nine mock-ups and we selected the best elements from the lot. After that I wrote the text for the accompanying promotion. Yet to create is the material to fill the space I have been given in the tour guides.

A good deal of research goes into the work of creating a design that will convey a message. The fact that I have been giving new life to fixtures from the thirties, forties, fifties, and sixties for many years is not enough. I needed to know what the term Mid-Century Modern means, not only to me and not only to others, but what the usual range of meanings are because these things can be somewhat controversial and I am not interested in taking a stand but in communicating at large.

I was intrigued to see that the colors I am familiar with in the fixtures of the period were repeated in design and advertising. I learned not only the origin of the term Mid-Century Modern but that it and indeed most of the terms used to describe periods in design came well after the end of the period in question. I searched and read through a good deal of material, the consequence of which is a whole new appreciation of the period. I no longer see Mid-Century Modern only as it relates to my work but to furnishing, architecture, art, and even open spaces and life style.

"It feels refreshing to think about what, to me, were good and positive times."

I was born in 1950 and grew up in the suburbs of Long Island, New York. I have an old familiarity with the colors and forms we are working with on this project. Formerly when I perused my old manufacturer catalogs I would focus on the fixtures, remembering which I had worked on and who I had done the work for.

Now it seems as though my reminiscences have really come alive. I can't help but think of the bright colorful advertisements for the refreshments available at the concession building before they began to play the Tom and Jerry cartoons at our local drive-in theater. I think about what it was like inside the Cape Cod style house we lived in, the floors and counter tops, the tables and chairs. It feels refreshing to think about what, to me, were good and positive times.

RestoreOregon Mid-Century Modern Home Tour Advertisement.
The image comes from an old Standard catalog.

Perhaps the enjoyment I feel when I work on the fixtures of that period is not simply because the work is easier. I know that the styles and forms speak to me artistically but what I had not considered is that I probably associate those fixtures with pleasant memories.  

Is is easier to work on the fixtures from those decades than it is to restore fixture from near the turn of the century. The parts are easier to attain and the valves were meant to be repaired with parts that could be easily replaced.

While the porcelain on cast iron was about the same grade of product as it had always been, the vitreous china ware was much better material. You never see the crazing in it that is so common with the older stuff and because of that it seems more sanitary.

Mid-Century Modern plumbing fixtures are also plentiful. There are many to be had and many remain in their original settings. I am particularly fond of the wall hung lavatories that were set with stainless steel legs in front, what we call Leg Lavs.

 I have been able to acquire various fixtures, faucets, and sets of hardware from the period that are "New old stock". I have sets of lavatory legs, some with integral towel bars along with faucets by Crane and Standard. I'm hoping the new advertising will help me find more work on Mid-Century fixtures and help me find homes for some of the new and used stock I have to offer.    

Glorious Day

Another great old standing waste arrived today. I restrained my urges enough to get a photo of the large box before I took it to my basement shop to open it and lay out its elements on one of my benches. Inside the box were four packages. Two were the hot and cold supply valves on their risers, the drain tower and yoke were in another. The fourth package held the strainer assembly with its drain boot and the tub spout. It is a "fuller ball" style tub filler with accompanying tower drain. The set was made by the American Standard company and is marked with their trademark, "Stanard". 

I had been emailed images of the parts before me and knew what the complaints were. I found, of course, the usual toothed tool scars that I find so cavalierly brutal considering that there are  hexagonal wrench flats on all the parts that need them. Lifting the sections out of their packaging I set the packing material aside separately until I confirmed that it held no further small parts. While I did that I examined the emerging assemblies, seeing them as both what they were and what they could be. The problem solving, the making of the mental list, and first insights and strategies had already begun.

I had to stop myself at that point. I needed to get my before photos. Stopping my process to photo journal does not come naturally to me but I am always disappointed in myself when I don't have a set of before photos. I couldn't just snap some quick pix either. The result of that would not likely render anything worthy of publishing and there are more than enough disappointing photos on my website already. Photographing my work, before and after, has become a separate project in itself. Since we are all busy being creative around here it is not a project I can delegate regularly. Even if it were though I would want to embrace learning new skills.

Previously I would open and view new projects as they came in but not begin actual work on them until I had cleared the benches of already begun projects. I was trying to be extra careful of keeping the parts separated and turning out work in a timely manner. Now, with the amount of work that is arriving, I have begun a job box system so that various projects are kept separate and proceed as parts and materials arrive. I begin to process each project as it comes in and am no longer idle while awaiting deliveries. I was never really idle because there is plenty of work to do locally but my goal is to eventually move all operations into the realm of vintage repair and restoration.

I am pleased to say that I have turned the corner at this point. Last year the shop generated more income than the van did. I am steadily refusing more and more types of non-vintage work, though it is difficult to refuse the clients that have supported me over the years. As I write this, I am preparing copy for my new "vintage-only" ad campaign.  

Worn to Brass

A few weeks ago I was contacted, via my plumbing-geek web mail, by a new client in Texas who was restoring an 1850s cabin on a rural property there. He had been looking at lav taps on sites like Ebay to compliment the lavatory he was using. He told me that he was searching for a pair of taps that were "worn to brass". He had found a single tap that suited him but had not purchased it and wanted to know if I had a potential mate for it. He went on to say that if I had a pair in stock he would be interested in seeing them but that in any case, whether he provided or I did,  he wanted me to work up a pair of taps for his cabin. In the original contact email he included the URL of the web page where the one tap was being offered. I looked it over and proceeded to root through my stock of unfinished taps for something that might match what I had seen on the web page, or failing that a pair that might be suitable. The two problems with the tap on the internet were that I couldn't tell it's size from the photo and I didn't know if it would turn out to be serviceable.

As I sorted the contents of  boxes, selecting out singles and pairs tied together, looking at their surfaces with the term "worn to brass" in mind, the usual inner dialog was playing. I have never been a fan of the bare brass look. It reminds me of the early days of the restoration movement when people would strip old faucets of their nickle or chrome and install them in that raw state. From time to time someone would ask me to repair such a faucet or pair of taps and it always seemed so wrong to me, as a plumber with a mind set upon sanitation, to work on something that I just knew would get all green and funky. Those faucets were the very first vintage work I did though I didn't relish it at the time.

I laid out the result of my search and inspected what I could choose from. The term worn to brass was bugging me because it seemed so specific. I was looking at bare brass that had been tank stripped, wheel buffed, and maybe even sand blasted. A lot of my potential product had come in as a lot and I had been pulling the best of it out for work, not the most worn looking. Now, looking at these pieces my intuition was giving me red lights. I went back to the office and contacted my client to confirm and make sure I was reading him right.
I asked, "When you say "worn to brass" I assume you are looking for authentic aging and not stripped, sandblasted, or buffed down finishes".
I got back, "Thank you Brian and you are correct I basically want an unlacquered brass finish of an older unit. If it was an original brass finish then one with some patina. If it was nickel or chrome over brass then most of the nickel and chrome pitted or worn in places to show the brass beneath.

Thank you for your diligence".

The thing is, I was really becoming intrigued by this, and frustrated. Everything I looked at was off the mark. I understand patina but that usually concerns the remnant condition of a plated finish. For this project I was looking beyond patina to deep wear. 

Unable to find anything in storage I went to the shop where I keep a stock of  "product" to be put on the bench in times when there is a dearth of client work. These are select sets and the really raw stuff would likely go to the plater. Now I was thinking that might be a mistake and a good thing that I had found very little bench time that was not filled with client work. I selected three sets of taps and pulled each apart to confirm that they were yet serviceable. Once I was content that I could make each set function like new I started taking photos with my phone.
Interestingly enough, all three sets had the "Standard" stamping that showed they were made by American Standard yet each set was of a slightly different vintage.

First pair, nickel plating fairly intact under green oxidation.

"Standard" tap, independent packing nut.

RE-NU indicates replaceable seat and dates

tap to

 mid-twenties and beyond.

Second pair, nickel worn off of high points and pitted with some green patina present.

 Pre RE-NU lav taps, more sculpted bonnet nut. 

Seats milled into the castings on early faucets.

Pre RE-NU, circa 1900 to 1925

The third pair turned out to be not a pair at all, one is "Standard" the other is what one would call "Other". There are slight differences in the shape but I am convinced that these taps were once mounted side by side.

At first glance they are a pair.

Add caption

These taps must have been immersed in with some iron.

Iron introduced by dripping water and years under something rusting away.

Note the immersion rings on the spout of this lav tap.

Waiting

No one likes waiting. It seems that the more restoration projects I take on the more waiting I do.

Right now I have a 1920s surface mount tub valve on the bench. Actually it is in a sorting box to keep it all in one place and separated from other projects as it is disassembled. It had seats that were milled into the body and were worn out. I had to tap the body for new seats and that is normal enough, it is also normal to have the required seats in stock. These seats though must be 13/16ths"  OD by 27 threads per inch and I am out of that size. Because that is not a seat size anyone makes I must have them made so I am in line with the specialty machinist I use. He is making me twenty of them.
I have two sets of standing waste valves right now as well. Each about 1915 vintage and each in its own sorting box and waiting for parts.
The first has been here for at least 60 days, too long in my opinion but I had to have stems made for it and they are not stems anyone stocks. The original handle mounts were gone and the stems had been filed down to fit handles that were not original to the valves. I had to extrapolate what they would have been and discuss the required specs with the machinist. That took time but eventually the new stems were fabricated and delivered. I had them sent sans plating though because my local plater produces a better result than I can get from the plater the machine shop uses. The difference is the fineness of the polishing, If one wants a mirror bright nickel finish one must have the raw brass polished to mirror bright before it is plated, not after. My plater is an artist and knows exactly what I want. He is also very busy so my new stems are not back yet though they should be soon.

Not much left of this stem's "broach", the faceted top that the handle fits to.













The second set of valves are not being plated but they had to be tapped for new seats. The seat size I need for this set is almost as large as I can tap, 7/8ths" by 27 thread per inch. These really large seats are what one must use for the large standing waste valves that supplied lots of water for the old extra large claw foot and earthenware, (china), tubs. The "reseating" tools I use originally came with a large assortment of  seats to be installed after tapping the brass valve bodies with the tool. These seats were made of bronze, not yellow brass. They were made to last! I am almost out of this size seat though I once had quite a few of them. The good news though is that my machinist is not only making me twenty new seats, he is making them from the new required lead free brass. He tells me that I can expect the new brass to wear very well indeed and be much less corruptible than the old leaded yellow brass. 

You can see the notch in the original "milled in seat".



These valves are also waiting for stems. The original stems arrived at the machine shop two days ago now. They must have them in order to replicate them.

While I have been waiting I have cleaned every surface and thread on these valves. All of the new gaskets are also made and waiting.

Here are the new bright threads my tool creates for the upgrade seat.

Here are a few pictures of my last 7/8ths inch by 27 threads per inch bronze seat. As faucet seats go this thing is huge.

 


The wrench required to tighten this seat into place is certainly not a normal seat wrench. By using this seat though, with it huge orifice, I compliment the original engineers intent. That was to create a large flow of water that would fill the oversize tub quickly enough to have it not cooling already before it was full. 












The last of the currently waiting projects are a pair of fuller ball taps that were sent to me to be serviced. I had them done and ready for pressure testing the day after they arrived only to find out that the stem nuts were not sent with the rest of the taps. I must have them in order to test my work. They are in the mail, I thought they would be here by now. I'm going to be really busy if all of these parts come at the same time.

Learning Thomas Maddocks and more.

Gleaned from emails:

Client: Looking for faucets for an integrated spout Thomas Maddock sink.

Brian: I have those faucets and have been looking for a sink. What model is it? How about a few photos.

Client: It's really in good shape. I little dirty from sitting in the barn for 20 or so years. It has a pencil or 'peg-leg' pedestal. I will send a better pic of the whole thing once I clean it up. I have some handles and escutcheon pieces that I think will work. 

That would be awesome if you had some valves I could use for this project.

Brian: As I had hoped it is a "Madbury". I have everything but the drain pop-up assembly. I will get you some pix of the handles, they are special. Somewhere I have a photo of the original catalog page. I will piece it together and send you an email. Let me see what handles you have please.

Client: Cool, sounds great.

Brian: OK, I sent you a bunch of iPhone photos of your fixture in the 1924 catalog, the parts I have for it, and how they come together to form the motif and esthetic the designers created. I could fax you scanned images from the catalog if you like. As you can see the handle is skirted and fits over the escutcheon in such a way as to prevent any metal from showing when the valve is off. This is what is alluded to in the written description that says, 

"All metal parts above the slab are completely covered with china." 

 It was the supper sanitary look that was craved at the time. Kitchens and baths were all white, white, white. I see that you have the drain pull still, if it is original it has the same feature. There is a slight cupping at the bottom of the pull that fits neatly over the metal hold down of the escutcheon.

I had a client print a page from the internet, this was before I had my own Maddocks book. He had a Maddocks lavatory like yous but with the full size pedestal, not the stiletto pedestal. In it were the valve bodies only, no stems, no trim. He wanted me to not only complete the faucets but to make it all original as in the photo. It was a real challenge to me and I dove into it. Being challenged is what plumbing-geek is all about, it is what has taken me from plumber to artisan. In the course of the next year I researched and resourced Maddocks valves and trim. When I found extra on e-bay I picked it up. I had fresh stems made by my faucet specialty machine shop. Enough for the one project plus more to complete the extra valve bodies I had found. Almost no one has the understanding of this fixture that I have attained. "Thomas Maddock's Sons Co." simply referred to as Maddocks stems are not in any of stem replacement catalogs, not even the vintage specialty companies I use for the normally no longer made parts I get for people. I had these stems made special, to my specs. I had to send the valve bodies to Colorado and talked to the machinist at length to get the specs right. The most difficult part was the drain assembly. I found an original but the guy would not part with it once he understood how rare it was. In order to secure it I had to design and fashion a replacement part for his restoration project, we then did a swap. I actually fulfilled the task of creating what there was only a vintage photo of. It took about a year to manage it.
 

In the end my client had no appreciation or understanding of the journey I had undertaken for his project. The completed fixture, assembled and installed, secured to the wall with vintage brackets was a triumph for me but a simple expense to him. Other facets of his extensive remodeling had run over budget by then and I was just one more guy with my hand out. I had taken nothing up front, I never have.

The fixture restoration and installation was my task, the rest of the remodel plumbing was being done by a regular plumbing contractor. I tried early on to get the drain they had installed lowered but the response was, "Are you sure it needs to be lowered?" I took my measurements and told them it would make it by a quarter inch, so we let it stand. The thing is though that at that time I was planning to use a non-original drain assembly. I had no idea that an original would become available. When it did, later on, the client would not settle for less. The wall in the meantime was closed and the drain was too high. I was on budget, exactly as I had proposed. The client thought that I should lower the drain at no extra cost and I deferred. I had already provided the original drain at no extra cost though I had to make gaskets for it as well acquire it. Another contractor lowered the drain and installed my drain assembly, I did not get my non-original drain assembly back. Much later, to my great surprise, I was paid the bid amount. The client seemed so bitter that I had thought that the job was going to be a total loss.

You are probably wondering why I have related this story to a prospective new client. First, I think it helps to let you know what is involved in this kind of work. This work is not in the realm of what is ordinarily possible to get. Second, I want you to know that I go all out, but I am a plumber. When a plumber goes all out there is money involved. The job I described above came in at under three thousand, I thought that was remarkable, considering what I achieved. Third, I want you to know the way it plays out sometimes working with the public. Some people will understand, while some never do. It has become part of the challenge, this aspect of staying on the same page between effort and recompense in such a small and narrow field of expertise. Just recently I had this incredible response to my efforts to stave off financial misunderstandings.

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Hi Brian,

Thank you for the update.  Yes I am comfortable with that amount.  I've posted to you today a check for the total anticipated amount of $####. As far as I’m concerned you can deposit it immediately if you wish. Of course if there are any unforeseen expenses that come up later I'll be happy to reimburse you for them.

Brian you are clearly an artist, scholar and master craftsman of the first order in your field.  I admire and respect that.  No matter how this ultimately transpires this has been an interesting adventure and a learning experience. My wife asked me to say that if you are ever in Atlanta, we'd like for you to come by the house for dinner.

Again, we both appreciate all of your patience, guidance and creative efforts on our behalf.  Thanks. Regards,

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I hope this has not scared you off. On the other hand, if you thought that this is easy and inexpensive, I hope it has. I would love to explore your project further and get to the required wall supports and the parts you may actually be using. I am mentally playing with a way to upgrade this to ceramic disc by switching the rough-in valves to mid-century Crane integral spout valves, though the reach is a bit less. 

Thanks, Brian.      BTW, this long winded response was also intended for the blog as a new post. I do not normally carry on so in my emails.

Client: You have some great experience with these sinks it sounds like. I have attached a picture of some faucet handles I rounded up from deep in the workshop. So if I can get these to work, they have a square receiver for the valve stem, all I need are two valve stems and a bracket to hang the sink on.

Do you have some stems that you would sell me?

 Brian: Showing the valve body without the gaskets or gasket nut. I have not yet made the gaskets.

Client: Those valves look like they would work. The sink holes, where the valves are installed, is about 1.5 inches. The escutcheons I have measure about 1 5/8 inches from the base of the escutcheons to the top of the square receiver. 

Do you think those valves will work? Are those something you pieced together? They look great. How much for a set of two if you think they would work?

Also how is this mounted to the wall?

Brian: This is a link to an item for sale on eBay. 20 hours left, no bids. These brackets are for holding a free standing sink to the wall. Free standing in this case means that there is a gap between the sink and the wall, usually an inch, but the sink must still be stabilized by the wall. These brackets attach to fittings that mount into holes in the rear bottom of the sink.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Wall-Mounted-Cast-Iron-With-Porcelain-Pedestal-Sink-Brackets-/151555081839?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item234963066f

This type of fitting fits into the china with some rubber to keep the china safe from the metal.

I don't know about your trim fittings, handles and escutcheons. The valves I showed you are made for your sink. They seal with rubber above and below because the china becomes a water channel. I have not made new gaskets for them yet. I am considering a price, I may need to go back and consider my cost for the work I had done to make them.

Client: I have put a bid on brackets. Let me know about the valves.

Thanks for all the info!

Brian: The two sets of valves I have are slightly different. I am setting you up with the ones that have a longer reach to accommodate your 1-1/2" depth.

I will send you a photo of one of them in a separate email momentarily.  

I have done my research on how much I have into these valve parts.

The original cost of the Maddocks valve bodies on eBay,                                                        $120

Cost of machining I had done on them to create replaceable seats where the milled in seats were, $60

Cost of two new stems custom made to my specs,                                                              $120

My shop time to clean all parts before machining, create two upper and two lower neoprene
mounting gaskets to seal the bodies into the ports in the sink, and assemble the valves.
Two hours each body at $120 per hour,  

$480

I don't think your trim will work as I cannot stay in the 1-5/8ths inch zone.

The tops of my stems are at about 3". My 2" tall china escutcheons will work and I will throw those in.
Square inset handles will work with them to have exposed plated stems.

I don't currently have escutcheon hold downs or handles I favor for the stems

but your square inset handles might go onto the stems.

The stem squares are .340" and are drilled and tapped for set screws. I can provide the set screws.  

So the complete valves, assembled and ready to install, the porcelain escutcheons, and the set screws would come to $780

Let me know.

Client: Thanks for putting all that together for me

So $780 is pretty expensive for me. I wonder what, to help rationalize the cost, I could sell the whole sink system for? Do you have any idea of what a working sink of this type is valued at?

Thanks for all your help!

Brian: I have been trying to find one, as I have said. I was willing to pay $500 for one in good condition, shipping is always a question. Once I had it restored I would be displaying it for a prospective buyer. That is the hard part, the prospect of sitting on it till I could find a home for it. I would ask no less than $2000 and no more than $2500 for it uninstalled. That of course would be with the no metal showing look that matches the image in the catalog. That is the selling point, the recreation of the designers intended look.
At this time I do not have an original drain for it and would have to deal with that as well.

I know the cost of my parts and help are expense, it is a constant problem for people at the casual level of interest. Many people acquire fixtures at very low prices, because the seller has no idea, then are shocked at the difficulty and cost of completing the fixture. Even fixtures that are complete must be made to function again, sometimes after decades of not being in use.

Let me know what you would like to do.

Client: Sounds good.

I have the original drain and stopper. It needs a little work but should be operable.

Thanks and we will talk soon.

 Brian: Great, I will prepare the mounting gaskets.

I had some other projects to finish but I got to your gasket fab. and assembly today.

The valves are now tested and the gaskets are in place.

There is a thin top gasket, a thick tapered bottom gasket, a friction washer, and a nut.

The stems are unusual because the escutcheon hold downs are male instead of female. I thought this could present a problem for you so I cleaned up an old pair of female trims. They could use to be re-plated but they fit and I am giving them to you. I will see about also throwing in a pair of porcelain escutcheons, I have lots of them. I would like this installation to go smoothly for you. I will leave the handles to you, but let me know if you get stuck trying to find a proper fit. Here are the final photos.

I will invoice you via PayPal.

They look good. I really can't afford them right now, this being our slowest time of the year at our B&B.

What did you say the price would be? I think you said about $700?

I do appreciate your work and passion.

The price was $780. I totally understand about the slow season.

Thanks, Brian.

Epilogue: Looks like I misinterpreted "sounds great". So it goes, anyone have a Madbury for sale?